[FOM] regarding attribution to Kreisel

Adriano Palma Palma at ukzn.ac.za
Fri Dec 30 02:04:03 EST 2011

** Low Priority **
** Reply Requested by 12/30/2011 (Friday) **

Dear haim, the other place to look at is the long survey on mathematics
and logic (collected in Saaty, Lectures on modern mathematics, published
in 1960's) 
Once upon a time the discussion you proposed was checked by Alasdair
Urquart and by W. Tait. I believe if you look at the FOm "archives" the
posts may be available with further information.
last resort, asking Georg Kreisel.
Sorry for the double posting, but it came to my mind in two "rounds"
adriano palma
ξε ν’, γγέλλειν Λακεδαιμονίοις     ἀ ὅτι τ δε
κείμεθα, το ς κείνων ῥήμασι πειθόμενοι.
/begin/read__>sig.file: postal address
University of KwaZulu-Natal Philosophy
3rd floor of Memorial Tower Building
Howard College Campus
Durban 4041
South Africa
Tel off: [+27] 031 2601591 (sec: Mrs. Yolanda Hordyk) [+27]
Fax [+27] 031-2603031
mobile 07 62 36 23 91 calling from overseas +[27] 76 2362391
EMAIL: palma at atacama.ehees.fr
EMAIL: palma at ukzn.ac.za
MY OFFICE # IS 290 at Mtb 
*only when in Europe*: inst. J. Nicod
29 rue d'Ulm
f-75005 paris france
email me for details if needed at palma at atacama.ehess.fr
This e-mail message (and attachments) is confidential, and/or
privileged and is intended for the
use of the addressee only. If you are not the intended recipient of
this email you must not copy, distribute, take any action in reliance on
it or disclose it to anyone. Any confidentiality or privilege is not
waived or lost by reason of mistaken delivery to you.
This entity is not responsible for any information not related to the
business of this entity. If you
received this e-mail in error please destroy the original and notify
the sender.

>>> Haim Gaifman <hg17 at columbia.edu> 12/29/2011 6:08 PM >>>
I shall be grateful to anyone who can find in Kreisel's works
the dictum expressed by the following quote that was attributed to
him  in a 1963 lecture by Dummett:

"The point is not the existence of mathematical objects, 
but the objectivity of mathematical truth".

Dummett refers to Kreisel's review of Wittgenstein. But Kreisel's
review of "Remarks on the foundations of mathematics" (in the British
Journal of the Philosophy of Science, 1958) contains no such quote. 
The nearest it comes to something that might suggest the idea is
in a footnote (1, page 138): 
"Incidentally, it should be noted that Wittgenstein
argues against a notion of a mathematical object (presumably:
substance),  but, at least in places (p. 124,35
or p. 96, 71, lines 5 and 4 from below) not against the objectivity
of mathematics"

I believe that the idea came to Dummett as he was reading the review,
and the quote is his own formulation. I could not find the dictum in
other review of Wittgenstein, nor in other works that I checked.
attribution appears to be the only source for the folklore about the
source of the dictum. 

I should add that I have a personal stake in this inquiry. Dummett's
1963 lecture appeared in print in his paper "Realism" published first
his 1978 collection "Truth and other enigmas". Previous to that I 
published in Erkenntnis in 1975 and 1976 two parts of a work entitled
"Ontology and Conceptual Frameworks" which was devoted to an
elaboration of a position based on the dictum. When I wrote the
first part I was unaware of Dummett's 1963 lecture. Putnam called my
attention to Dummett and, following the folklore,to Kreisel and I
mentioned them in the second part.
 As far as I know my work was the first in which such a position
appeared in print,
though it might be implicit in Dummett's previous published work.
I can be mistaken, and will be thankful for further information.

I came to this question as I was writing a paper "On Ontology and
Realism in Mathematics", to appear in the Review of Symbolic Logic.
Further philosophical clarifications of the issue will be found
 in the introductory section 1.

Haim Gaifman

Please find our Email Disclaimer here: http://www.ukzn.ac.za/disclaimer/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: </pipermail/fom/attachments/20111230/69a1fe47/attachment-0001.html>

More information about the FOM mailing list