[FOM] alleged Hilbert quote

[billy hudson]

For a reference to the Blumenthal converstation see page 208 of I.
Grattan-Guiness's "The Search for Mathematical Roots . . ." where
Hilbert is quoted as saying 'one must be able to say "tables, chairs,
beer-mugs" each time in place of "points, lines, planes"'.
Grattan-Guiness gives references Blumenthal, 402-403.

Blumenthal, O (1876-1944)
*1935a.* "Lebensgeschichte", in Hilbert *Papers 3*, 388-435.

Hilbert, D, (1862-1943)
*Papers. Gesammelte Abhandlungen*, 3 vols., 1932-1935, Berlin (Springer)
= 1970 = 1966, New York (Chelsea).

Grattan-Guiness also says "this famous remark is normally misunderstood
and Hilbert may not have thought it through at the time" (p. 208). He
then goes on to do an analysis of the remark on page 209. 

cheers,
billy

> -----Original Message-----
> From: fom-bounces at cs.nyu.edu [mailto:fom-bounces at cs.nyu.edu] 
> On Behalf Of Jeffrey Ketland
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 11:05 AM
> To: FOM at cs.nyu.edu
> Subject: Re: [FOM] alleged Hilbert quote
> 
> 
> Vladik Kreinovich:
> 
> > While Hilbert probably never said that math is a 
> meaningless game with
> > symbols,
> > ths spirit of this phrase is somewhat similar to a famous 
> actual citation
> > from
> > Hilbert's Intro to his Foundations of Geometry:
> >
> > "One must be able to say at all times -- instead of points, straight
> > lines, and
> > planes -- tables, beer mugs, and chairs."
> 
> Actually, this quote comes from a conversation with Otto 
> Blumenthal at a 
> Berlin train
> station. It certainly doesn't appear in Hilbert's Foundations 
> of Geometry.
> 
> The Introduction to The Foundations of Geometry is quite 
> short, and says the 
> following:
> 
>     Introduction
>     Geometry, like arithmetic, requires only a few and
>     simple principles for its logical development. These
>     principles are called the axioms of geometry. The
>     establishment of the axioms of geometry and the
>     investigation of their relationships is a problem which
>     has been treated in many excellent works of the
>     mathematical literature since the time of Euclid. This
>     problem is equivalent to the logical analysis of our
>     perception of space.
>     This present investigation is a new attempt to establish
>     for geometry a complete, and as simple as possible,
>     set of axioms and so deduce from them the most
>     important geometric theorems in such a way that the
>     meaning of the various groups of axioms, as well as
>     the significance of the conclusions that can be drawn
>     from the individual axioms, come to light.
>     (D. Hilbert, 1899, Foundations of Geometry,
>     Open Court, 1997. Translated by Leo Unger.
>     "Introduction", p. 2.)
> 
> Regards --- Jeff
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Jeffrey Ketland
> Department of Philosophy
> University of Edinburgh
> George Square
> Edinburgh EH8 9JX
> United Kingdom
> jeffrey.ketland at ed.ac.uk
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> 
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